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1 Password 8...Opportunity?

Was wondering if you guys have watched this?

1Password 8 Interview

This is a great opportunity to promote mSecure to their users who are unhappy about a) a brand new, completely re-written App and b) their move to a Subscription licencing model.

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Thanks Mike - please remove me, I know what I need to from the thread.

As for a re-written app: that will also be the way the new v 6 of mSecure works, right? And also v6 will be subscription. 

I have a license of v 5, and earlier beta tested v6. I am now also beta testing v 8 of 1Password. And to be honest it has come a long way from the first version of the v 8 beta. I can't really say what the status of msecure 6 is, since I haven't received any answer to my question to re-join the beta program.

So as I see it, what mSecure has that 1Password in the future will lack is the possibility to save locally on your computer, and the possibility to use iCloud or Dropbox. 1Password will only allow their own cloud solution. So THAT is what makes me think mSecure has a niche in the password manager universe. That and the cost. Regardless if it is subscription or mot is costs less. And if you don't really need all the extra bells and whistles that 1Password (and Dashlane and the rest) has, and you don't want to run Chromium on your computer then this is where mSecure can get new customers.

As for the subscriptions: I too had that view before. If I pay once I am to keep it. But that is in fact the way it is for most apps that go to subscription. The old version you can still use but it will not be updated in the future. It's no big difference from paying an update cost for a new version. Difference is you pay per month instead of when a new version comes out. Which also means that you have a better chance of there actually will BE a new version.

If we want to keep independent developers alive we must accept that they-just like the rest of us-can't work for free. 

And there is a good side to subscriptions: It can make you think about if you really need those apps or if you can drop them. Myself I dropped Evernote for Apple Notes and never looked back.

I think that Tomas provides a very well thought out and balanced Post. I too really like the option to sync. over my local LAN or iCloud.  All I'd add is a) it's of course the Subscription Cost (per month or per year) that will determine staying/going elsewhere. Other companies still offer a 'One-Off Lifetime' option to try to cover both bases when a Subscription Model is in place. I've previously quoted KinoMap as a good example of this.

@Thomas Thank you for the detailed post. We learned a great deal from our v5 release where we took out the option for Dropbox, iCloud and Wi-Fi syncing. The most vocal customers were those who wanted to keep their information locally on there devices and not sync it to any type of cloud service. I too agree this is a niche for us, and I can't foresee us removing it again. I can't say it will never happen for certain, as I don't get the final say in those decisions, but we know that having sync options aside from our proprietary sync service, especially the option to sync via Wi-Fi, is one of the strongest differentiating factors for mSecure.

Also, I'm not sure what happened with getting you back on the v6 beta, but I can get you back on the list. It's very close to the public release now, it could be out as early as February 15th, but if you still want to use the latest beta release, please let me know and I'll do it.

@Jules Thanks again for your post. The feedback on the pricing model for v6 is always welcome.

Hi. I thought I would chime in here. I’ve been using 1Password for Mac for over 12 years. I’ve used the standalone version the whole time and it’s met all my needs. But the next version, version 8, is subscription-only and I dislike paying subscriptions for software. Subscriptions add up, and unless the software is adding new features every month, I think subscriptions are a rip off. 

Regarding 1Password specifically, most of the features included in the subscription version versus the standalone version are features I don’t need:  1 GB document storage (my 1Password vault is only 4.3 megabytes), 365 day item history to restore deleted passwords (I’ve never had to find a deleted password), Travel Mode to safely cross borders (not sure what this means but I’m sure I don’t need it) and password sharing (something else I’ve never needed). I also don’t need to have my vault saved on 1Password’s servers when Dropbox has worked just fine for me for years.

So, I’ve been looking for an alternative to 1Password and I’ve tried a number of them. mSecure 5 is my clear favorite. And I just learned, from these forums, that version 6 is imminent and will have features I’ve been wanting that version 5 doesn’t seem to have: tags and auto-logins. Regarding tags: I’m hoping with mSecure 6, I can import my 1Password items and that the tags will be retained (they weren’t when I imported my 1Password items into mSecure 5).

But then I saw in these forums that msecure is also migrating to a subscription model! So I’m torn and disappointed. I don’t see why I should pay monthly for mSecure if I’m saving my data in Dropbox or iCloud. 

I also saw in these forums that if I buy version 5 now, that the premium features of version 6 will be available to me without a subscription. So I may buy version 5 today before it’s too late. However, buying it is a risk because I haven’t experienced mSecure’s auto login features, since, as far as I can tell, version 5 doesn’t have such a feature (there seems be no Safari extension and the link to the webpage for the Chrome extension leads to a missing page). So, I have no idea if mSecure 6 has a login feature that’s anything close to 1Password’s.

The only other app I’m considering is Secrets but its user-interface and features are not on par with mSecure. However, it does not use the subscription model for payment. 

I also want to add that I think there is a payment model that makes more sense than subscriptions. It’s the business model that BusyCal uses. When you buy BusyCal, you get free updates for 18 months. After 18 months, you can still use the application but you no longer get updates. If you want updates, you can then pay to extend your license for another 18 months. I think that’s a more fair system than a pure, subscription model. I won't lose my BusyCal calendar completely if I decide not to extend my license. Initially, I was thinking I wouldn’t renew my license for BusyCal when my license expires, but BusyCal has added enough new features in the last 18 months that I’m now considering renewing my license when the time comes.

Anyway, I’m going to have to make the decision to buy mSecure 5 pretty soon if I want to avoid paying the subscription for mSecure 6. I think that’s a bit silly and that it would be less convoluted if mSecure just kept using the standalone payment model.

Actually, now I see that I misread in these forums how version 6 will work for people who paid for version 5. People who paid for version 5 will have access to the essential features but not the premium feaures of version 6. So that may mean tags and auto-logins are only avallable via subscription. Since that's the case, I'm not going to buy version 5 and I may not subscribe to version 6. However, I'll try out the trial version of version 6 to see how well its login feature works. One positive thing I can say about 1Password is that its auto-login feature work great. I'm now back to testing out Secrets and its auto-login feature is much less accurate than 1Password's. 

Me once more. I've spent half of today trying alternatives to 1Password. I've decided Secrets isn't a good choice. It's auto login feature doesn't work well and its user interface is pretty bad. I'm still planning to consider mSecure 6 and would likely buy it if it didn't require a subscription.

The  other alternative I've found is EnPass. It's basically a 1Password 7 clone but with a much less elegant design. But it supports tags and autologins and is free for use on Mac or Windows. Supposedly a Universal version for Mac is coming soon. And right now a lifetime license is only $29 on (normally  it's $79) and that license allows you to install it on unlimited other devices. 

However, 1Password version 7  is still working fine for me and it's a Universal app, unlike EnPass, so I may just continue using it until the  browser extensions no longer work with future versions of Safari and Chrome. 

But again, if mSecure 6 adds tags and auto-logins and weren't a subscription, it would be my clear choice to switch from 1Password.

I’m not going to ”rate” different password managers. I’ve tred a lot of them since 1Pw announced they will go Electron. I’m not going to discuss pros and cons with Electron either: it’s up to everyone to decide if the memory issue and the installation of chromium is ok ir not. There is a reason why I now use mSecure and will continue to do so even with subscription. If you din’t want to pay a subscription out of a principle reason then I guess mSecure, 1Password, Dashlane, LastPass and others is out if the question. To me subscriptions isn’t an issue for some types of apps. And as I understand it the cost for mSecure will be around 10 USD or so per year. I see it as a way to keep the company running and the app developing.

Tomas, thanks for your thoughts. If mSecure 6 has tags and a working auto-login feature and is only $10/year then I may be willing to pay for the subscription. I have yet to see any subscription software for Mac whose yearly price is that low. 

Me again. I just went through the discussion in these forums about mSecure 6 and saw this about its pricing: The "Premium" tier is normally $29.99/year, but it will be discounted to $14.99/year for Pro users. 

So, the subscriptuon price is not going to be $10/year and I would definitely want access tothe premum tier. So, sadly, I'm not going to be subscribing to it. 

Hi Skylamsr ( and others). Well I must have forgotten then. But to me even 14:99 is cheap, considering the price others charge. And I get a native MacOS app and not one of those Electron/Chromium memory hogs. I too of course would like to get all new stuff for free, But I can’t expect mSecure staff work for free just to give me a free upgrade. As for the discussion for or against subscriptions I feel that train has gone, as we say in my country. So My advice would be that you see if you can get an app that fills your needs for free or a one-time purchase and just hope they will be around long enough. To me-if I pay 14:99 per years for constant upgrades or 49:99 every other year for a new version in one-time pay doesn’t matter. But I respect anyone that thinks otherwise. After all there are lots of apps out there. You’ll probably find one that fits your needs.

Tomas, thanks again. I have not purchased mSecure 5, so I'm not a Pro user. So mSecure 6 would cost me $29.99/year for the features I'd want, which is pretty close to the price of 1Password.

I could buy the Pro version of mSecure 5 now, to lock in the discounted price for mSecure 6, but I still don't know if mSecure 6 will meet my needs without trying it first and I also think even $14.99 is slightly overpriced.

I also think, as I mentioned earlier, that subscriptions are only worth the money if the application is constantly adding new features. But it's taken mSeven two years to finish the update from mSecure 5 to mSecure 6, so they are on a fairly slow development place. That pace seems fine to me if they are charging for standalone licenses, but that pace is not acceptable, in my mind, for subscription licenses. If mSecure 5 had already been a subscription, those two years would have cost $60 with only minor improvements. So, I really feel that the switch to a subscription model is a money grab. Will mSeven really speed up their developent process simply because the payment model has changed to subscriptions? I really doubt it.

Yes, I am not happy about Electron apps either. And right now, my choice, if I had to switch from 1Password, would be EnPass because of its price. As I said before, it's free for macOS and a lifetme license to use on unlimted devices is only $29. I don't know if EnPass is an Electron app or not, but it's definitely ugly. But I would rather have ugly than pay $29.99 every year for an app that's prettier but has about the same functionality.

Later this year I am planning to buy an Apple Slicon Mac. If I find that EnPass is a memory hog because of the way its written (maybe it uses Electron), then I will look into yet another alternative.

I do think mSecure 6 wll probably be superior to 1Password and EnPass (though it depends on how well mSecure's auto-login feature works), but I think $29.99/year is an unreasonable price. That's the same price as the standalone license for version 5. I think subscripion pricing should be lower to offer real value to end users.

Just bought a lifetime license for EnPass on for $26.99 (it was$29.99 plus I had a $3 credit). I bought it now because supposedly the sale is ending in 24 hours though Stack Social often extends the timeframe of their sales.

EnPass is great at importing 1Password data and feels pretty similar to 1Password in terms of features and design, I don't believe Enpass in an Electron app. I believe it uses the QT framework, but I'm not a programmer so I don't know if the QT framework is better or worse than Electron.

I also used Activity Monitor to check EnPass's memory usage and it uses less memory than 1Password 7, even though 1Password 7 is a native Mac app.

But I would have happily waited and spent my $29.99 on mSecure 6 if a standalone license was going to be available.  Or  I would have waited to pay for a subscription if mSecure 6's premium features would be available at $10/year as Tomas had thought.

Skylamar:Enpass doesn’t use Electron. I tried it before and it is ok.

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